[Haruchai]

Hey everybody!

I'm sure that everyone here is quite a bit more knowledgable than I am, so I'd like to get some information.

I'll soon be purchasing an electric vehicle. I plan to install my own electronics/motor/ESC/etc... Will somebody please tell me the differences in all the electric motors out there? There seem to be dozens. I'm not familiar with how the number of winds affects things, what the difference is between stock and modified motors, and how to gear your vehicle for various motors.

This vehicle will mainly be used for bashing, since the closest track is about an hour or so away. Please keep that in mind, since I really don't need the hottest race motor.

How much maintenance do electric motors need? How often do brushes need to be changed?

Now, I know the next question is personal preference, but I really can't decide on what vehicle to buy. Since I'll be spreading the cost of the vehicle and accessories out over a few months, I won't be dropping a huge wad of cash all at once. What are the benefits to buggies vs. stadium trucks vs. monster trucks? What about the 1/18th scale?

Any answers you can provide will be greatly appreciated, as well as your patience with a guy who is just learning.

[globaltruckin]

others will be more knowlegdable than me but i can help with the "winds" of a motor and the car differences
1. The lower the winds in a motor the "faster" your car will be but for off road you dont want to go to low because in my opinion under 9-10 winds will not have enough torque to do any serius off roading. if you wanna go fast and have good amounts of torque i would stay in the 12-17 turn range. again this is just my opinion
2. 2nd Thing is that the more winds the more run time you will get run time will also be determined by the quality of the esc.
TYPE OF RC
this is probably going to cause an argument but: the buggys are usualy harder to drive yet a little faster
stadium trucks have wide stance and are easy to drive but a little slower than the buggys
monster are also easy to drive yet drink lots and lots of volts, they are usualy faster out of the box because of the two motors and usualy 2 speed
1/18th scale i have no experience in

[Haruchai]

Hey! Thanks for the reply globaltruckin!

Ok, let me make sure I have this straight... A 10 turn motor is faster than a 17 turn, but the 17 turn has more torque and usually a longer run time? Assuming that the ESC is equal. What about some of the motors I have seen that are a 10x2 turn? I have no idea what those mean.

Hmmm... from what you've said it sounds like a stadium truck will be easier to drive (i.e. more forgiving), and almost as fast as a buggy. That might be my best bet. Looking through several sites I see that a lot of vehicles have pretty good support. I'll probably order my vehicle and accessories from Tower Hobbies, so I want to make sure it is something they'll have parts for.

[tadium54]

get whichever motor your esc can handle and your hobby shop stocks. the diffrence in the 2nd number, like a 10x1 or a 10x4, will be the useable power band. a 10x1 will have its most of its useable power in the bottom end, while a 10x4 will have most of its useful powerband in in the high end. don;t worry about it too much.

a stadium truck will be a little bit more stable for ya

[rocknbil]

Welcome aboard Haruchai!

To add a few peanuts . . .

Originally Posted by Haruchai

....what the difference is between stock and modified motors, and how to gear your vehicle for various motors.

Stock motors are to put racers in the stock class on the same power level, a stock motor is a 27 turn motor without modifications. Anything else is a mod. Strangely enough, the 27T motor is the optimum balance between the amount of RPM and torque you'll get from a 6-cell pack configuration.

Gearing is really vehicle-specific. Basically you look for the acceleration characteristics of the vehicle and watch for overheating. While larger pinions will give you higher top-end speed, often this will cause so much strain on the motor in low-speed driving or during accelleration it will cause the motor to overheat and you'll lose a lot of power. It's a good idea to have a range of pinions on hand, for my turcks I keep everything from 12-26 tooth pinions, 87-99 tooth spurs, and seldom use anything outside of 14-18 pinions.

A slight clarification on turns, winds, and mods: Lower turns indeed increase RPM (not necessarily "faster") and as the turns decrease, so does the torque. The torque is the ability to move the load, get you going from a dead stop, in and out of corners. So as you get progressively less turns on a motor, you need to gear DOWN to compensate. This still gives you the torque to get you going and makes use of the higher RPM of the mod's.

What about some of the motors I have seen that are a 10x2 turn? I have no idea what those mean.

Winds are the number of WIRES that are wrapped around the armature. So a 10x2 is two strands of wire wrapped around each pole of the armature 10 times. Like tadium said, doubles and triples are configured over singles to compensate for the deminishing characteristics of torque in mods.

More info on motors

Please keep that in mind, since I really don't need the hottest race motor.

And since you're considering a truck, which is a bit heavier than a buggy, a couple stock motors and a 17T mod will give you plenty of service and fun. Remember the comment about torque: the heavier weight requires more torque. You'll be well satisfied with any stock motor, to start off.

How much maintenance do electric motors need? How often do brushes need to be changed?

This much. It's a good idea to clean the motor every 3-6 charges. Change the brushes as required, I don't know, maybe 20 charges? 30?

Now, I know the next question is personal preference, but I really can't decide on what vehicle to buy. ... What are the benefits to buggies vs. stadium trucks vs. monster trucks?

Well it's incomplete and still needs a lot of pics, but here's an overview of things to think about when deciding, especially the Electric and Off-Road sections. Buggies are lighter and faster but require a lot more driving, trucks are more forgiving and easier to drive.

you can't go wrong with an AE T4 or an XXXT. Both of those are totally tunable and raceable if you ever decide to race.

[Haruchai]

Wow! Thanks for all the information rocknbil!

This board just goes to show that there are nice people on the internet that are willing to help and not just flame you. There's a lot of information there, but it was exactly what I was looking for.

I'd definitely like to build my own truck, so I'm glad you pointed out a couple that are easy to work on and will "grow" with me as I become more accustomed and immersed in the hobby.

[Haruchai]

Huh. Well if I stick with my original idea of buying through Tower then the Losi is out. Between the Losi and the Associated, is there really a clear winner in user-friendliness? There have been shoot-outs galore for these trucks and they seem very close, but which one is better for the beginner?

[gizmoguy303]

The MF2 (Losi XXX-T) is generally more stable and forgiving on the racetrack, easier to drive, and more durable than the T4. The T4 has more steering out of the box, handles more aggressively, and feels a bit more light on its feet. Both trucks can be tuned to drive as aggressive or neutral as you like, and they both are always in the winners circle at large races. The Losi has lower maintenance shocks, while the T4 has a lower maintenance differential. There is no clear winner. I have had both trucks and went with my MF2. My friend has had both, and went with his T4.

The MF2 is anywhere from $225 to $250, depending on where you buy it. The T4 Factory Team is around $200-$220 depending on where you buy it. Both are loaded with all the necessary racing options and don't need any upgrades.

Tower is a great place to order Associated stuff, and Stormer (www.stormerhobbies.com) is where I usually order my Losi stuff.


About motors: Generally, lower turns = more power. For example, a 10 turn motor is more powerful than a 19 turn motor of the same quality. Lower winds = more punch, higher winds = more top end. Two is most common wind to use (10x2, 12x2, etc.) A 10x1 would feel punchier than a 10x2 of the same motor, for example. Turns range from 27 (a stock motor) to 6 or 7 turns (pro-level touring car racing). Anywhere from 10 to 13 turns is usually what is used for a 2WD truck in the mod class. 10 to 14 turns is generally what is used for 2WD buggies, and 9 to 12 is usually what is used for 4WD buggies.

I HIGHLY recommend the Team Orion and Peak V2 motors. The Team Orion Revolution and Peak Vantage motors are the same motor - just different labels. A 14x2 would offer very good power and super low maintenance - exactly what a backyard basher needs. Spray it out after you're done for the day, and try to cut the comm whenever you can get someone to do it. You should be able to get 30-40 runs in without cutting the comm, as long as the motor is geared properly, kept clean, and allowed to cool between runs. Replace the brushes with the Enduro V2 brushes whenever you cut the comm.

Stock motors are 27x1, use bushings, laydown brushes, and have timing fixed at 24 degrees. Those are the general rules. Stock classes at tracks are very popular. The motors are slow enough for beginners to learn on, yet expert racers enjoy the competitiveness of trying to squeeze every last bit of power out of their motors.

About gearing: The manual that comes with your kit will have gearing recommendations. The key to keeping your motor alive and running its best is gearing it right. Follow the manual recommendations and you will be fine.

Hope this helps. Good luck!

Try out racing. It is very addictive and a lot more fun than bashing around.

[Haruchai]

Even more great help!

I might try racing, but I think I'll kinda want to "grow" into the vehicle a little bit. I'm sure there aren't too many people who are competitive at the racetrack right off the bat. There seems to be a lot to learn about motors, gearing, shock set-up, etc... It's probably a lot more simple than it sounds, but it is a bit overwhelming for a new guy.

Thanks for the link to Stormer. I'll go check things out.

[Kronic]

since you are a beginner and you want an electric truck id say go for the electric xtm x-cellerator because if you want to bash go ahead because it is sturdy and if you want to race go ahead because it is also a racing truck for beginners

[rocknbil]

Hrrm well just in case you don't know, the Losi vs AE debate has been going on since before my daughter was born, it's Ford vs. Chevy all over again. I've had both, and sold all the Losi's. Either is just as good.

Even the Stadium Truck Face-off they had in RCCA where they pitted top drivers against each other with both trucks, the one that showed the Losi a few seconds ahead of the AE, doesn't sway me much. I've never personally seen a race won or lost by a few seconds.

[Haruchai]

Thanks for the suggestion Kronic. Is the XTM available as a kit? I'll have to go find out.

Heh. Yeah, I kinda figured that it's a toss-up between AE and Losi trucks. However, since gizmoguy303 seems to know what he is talking about and gave me some great ideas of the difference in the trucks, I think I might lean towards Losi.

Is there any particular reason you sold your Losi's rocknbil? Is it just that you prefer the AE's?

The Duratrax Evader Pro ST has a great price, and I just read RCCA's review of it in the newest issue. I might consider it more if it was a kit. I really want the experience of building a kit and choosing my own electronics and motor and radio.

[rocknbil]

Well i didn't elaborate because I didn't want to get into (yet another!!) this vs. that argument. If you do a search on here and trip around the vehicle threads, you'll see enough pros/cons for both to make your own call. Incidentally, one of the things you'll see most about the comparison is that the AE's are more durable than the Losi's in almost any case. So here we go.

As for personal prefs, my first Losi was a JR2, then converted to a JRXT, then had two XX's. I thought they were light and too buggy-ish, they didn't "feel" like trucks to me. I then went through a T2 and T3, and those seems too . . . Losi-like. So I gave one away and sold the other, kept and still have my original RC 10T's.

If I were boil it down to one thing, it's the Stealth tranny. Nothing beats it, and outside of changes in the main diff gear size, it hasn't changed in over 10 years (guessing) because it works.