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  #101  
Old 08-09-2006, 01:06 PM
Shawn Palmer Shawn Palmer is offline
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RtsBasic:
It's out of spec, and not warranted, but yes - with the BEC disabled you can run 14cells. Just watch the overall rpm of the motor there (voltage x Kv).

Shawn
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  #102  
Old 08-09-2006, 01:58 PM
scoob scoob is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shawn_Palmer



3s and the 4600 is a really really nice system isn't it? "Not quite insane" power level, good long runtimes, and happy ESC and motor temps there. 500 watts never felt so nice....
That is exactly how I'd describe it. It's about perfect for my application. I'm going to be racing it in a local class in 20 minute mains in a T4. There are 30+ people in the "Pro-Truck" class and most have either a Novak 5.5/6.5, or a U-force 75 and Plettenburg Extreme with Thunder Power TP8000 2s pack. I'm going to be the first in the class with the MM and the first to run a 3s setup. The whole reason for my changing from the Novak is the efficiency of higher voltage and less heat. In 20 minute races, thermalling has been an issue for the Novaks and mine thermalled for the first time ever in the last race in 90+ heat.

One more question. I set my cuttoff voltage to 9.4v with the custom setup to give me a little more saftey margin on my 3s pack. Is this OK? I'm thinking 6000 mah on this high voltage setup should run 30+ minutes but all it has to make is 21-22 minutes.

Thanks.
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  #103  
Old 08-09-2006, 03:44 PM
Rtsbasic Rtsbasic is offline
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Thanks for the answer Shame to hear its beyond warranty spec to do so, I'll have to stick with my warrior 9920 as I don't want to risk running an ESC without warranty. The motor I would be using will only be turning ~35,000rpm on 14 cells.
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  #104  
Old 08-09-2006, 05:54 PM
addicted addicted is offline
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[QUOTE=Shawn Palmer]Addicted - sent you a PM. Please email me back at shawnp@castlecreations.com

Shawn sent you a return message Txs
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  #105  
Old 08-09-2006, 06:16 PM
Shawn Palmer Shawn Palmer is offline
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scoob:
Not only is that OK, but in the very near future most lipos will require on the order of 3.2v-3.3v per cell cutoffs. Depending on the "newness" and brand of packs you're using, you'll be ahead of the safety curve running even a 9.6v cutoff for your 3 cell pack.

One of the most damaging practices with lipo, is "deep discharging". This is where the pack is asked for large amp draws at the very end of it's capacity. The latest and greatest cells just barely, or don't show a dropoff at all in performance before the low voltage cutoff kicks in to protect the pack. If you're seeing this type of thing - raise the cutoff to 3.2v per cell (via the custom cutoff setting) because those packs need that increased cutoff voltage to keep from deep discharging.

Ultimately, the difference in runtime between 9.0v and 9.6v regardless of the pack will be extremely small. Basically when a 3 cell pack gets below 10v on average, it's just plain done.

RtsBasic:
I kinda wanted you to read between the lines there :-) Most folks aren't comfortable with using an alternate power sorce for the radio, and disabling the onboard BEC. That's why we spec'd it like we did. When you know what you're doing (Kv x voltage, amp know-how, realistic battery capability and etc.) it's no big deal to run the Max on 4s or 14-16 cells.

Shawn
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  #106  
Old 08-09-2006, 06:22 PM
Chopster Chopster is offline
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Shawn,

Thanks for taking our opinions to heart. A monster max with a 5mm shaft is exactly what I'd be looking for. I just can't see running the 1/8" shaft in an 1/8 scale buggy.
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  #107  
Old 08-09-2006, 09:29 PM
DeadSouls DeadSouls is offline
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Hi Guys,

I just wanted to let you know my experience with the Mamba Max and kv7700 motor I ordered. It arrived yesterday and I spent the majority of the evening prepping my car and the esc/motor. I soldered on Dean's ultra plugs to the ESC since my Maxamp 8000mah 2s1p lipo already had Deans. I let that sit while a cleaned up my chassis, shocks, etc.
Once the the car was ready I hooked the ESC up to my computer and started playing with the settings. I followed most of the suggestions in the manual but changed a few. I set the cut off voltage to a custom 6.3v to protect my lipo. I disabled punch control since I figured the Maxamp battery which is rated to support 128 peak amp discharge (10sec) and 96 amp constant could handle it. The Timing was normal.

I ran into an issue which I think was my fault when I tried to fit my 21t pinion gear. For some reason, I could not get the 21t pinion gear to mesh with my 87t spur gear. I couldn't back the motor up far enough. However, today I tried again and I was able to get a 19t pinion on but I haven't tried the 21t yet. I will try this weekend and let you guys know. Anyways, I used a 15t pinion with an 87t spur gear. This gave me a low top end but lots of torque.

After that I took it to a local baseball field and drove it. I spent my 20mins running around the park. I went from think grass to the dirt infield. My factory team T4 had a lot more torque but didn't do a wheelie. Maybe the battery was too heavy? However, if I caught a little jump in the grass at the full throttle the front end would lift up and sent the car tumbling.

In the dirt the car handled great. I was able to do a run around the bases at almost full throttle.

In about an hour I will be taking the car to my local track for race evening. I was able to fit a 19t pinion with my 87t spur gear. Also, this is my first time racing ever so I am looking forward to it. I let you guys know how it goes.
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  #108  
Old 08-09-2006, 11:18 PM
pimpride pimpride is offline
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Here is my 5700kv Mamba powered Pan Car on 8 cells-

http://media.putfile.com/Brushless-P...mes-on-8-Cells

Gearing is 17/84. Going to be putting a smaller spur and BIGGER pinion. It needs more speed. I might have to get a limn pack for it lol.
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  #109  
Old 08-10-2006, 12:36 AM
rca rca is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shawn Palmer
glassDr:

Setscrews in the motors - that's a fabulous idea! No heads protruding, cleaner look - I like it. That'll be the "glassdoctor version" when we can get it into production.

Shawn
Shawn, If the set screw version motor is out, can we send our motors back for replacement or modification to use set screws? Because MM motor can't fit some tamiya cars like the TL-01 series.

As for the monster max, I think its good to offer the option to choose 3.2 and 5mm shaft as mentioned. 3.2 mm for the standard electric trucks users and 5mm for the guys who wanna mod their nitro buggies. And yes please start a thread on " what do you want the Monster Max to be?"
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  #110  
Old 08-10-2006, 01:22 AM
Chopster Chopster is offline
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OK, I have more questions. First, when I initially got my 7700 system and began running it on 2S Lipo, it was crazy with all of the power. I couldn't even keep the front wheels on the ground. I ran it around today and I can hardly get it to pull the front wheels off of the ground. I have, of course, been progressively increasing the size of the pinion and decreasing the size of the spur, trying to find the fastest combo. My question is this, just for piece of mind. With this Mamba Max system, could there be something wrong with it that would cause it to be less powerful; or is it one of those things that either works or it doesn't?

More questions....

I want something faster, so I was considering the 4600 on 4S Lipo and the 5700 on 3S Lipo. I understand the issues on 4S Lipo regarding the BEC and warranty.

Which system would be more efficient? Will the temps go up as I increase the amount of voltage used? Considering a progressive move from the 7700 with 2S Lipo to the 5700 with 3S Lipo to the 4600 with 4S Lipo, does the current demand go down as I progress to a system that runs on a higher voltage?

As I may or may not have mentioned before, I want an all out fast parking lot racer. I'm using my RC10T4 as the platform (I have my reasons). I want a Jato 3.3 eater. On the other hand, I do want something reliable that won't cook itself to death. I was going to get a 5700 motor and run it on 3S Lipo, then learned that the Max system will run on 4S Lipo if I disable the BEC. I'll just unplug the BEC and tape a 6v hump pack to my chassis to feed the servo. That will get me very close to the 65,000 rpm "safe" limit.

Last edited by Chopster; 08-10-2006 at 09:37 AM.
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  #111  
Old 08-10-2006, 01:28 AM
pimpride pimpride is offline
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Did you watch that video of my car on 8 cells (9.6 volts)? A 3s on that would be crazy. I drove an employee's (Joe) T4 when I was at castle and he had the 5700 and a 3s lipo and it was just completely rediculous. Definately pushing 65 mph if you have a long enough straight, right gearing, and a gentle throttle finger (slightest touch and it would wheelie over backwards, even at 45mph).
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  #112  
Old 08-10-2006, 04:32 PM
JDT JDT is offline
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Is the maxamps 6000mah packs rated at 60 amp continuous and 72 amp burst enough for the max? How much better is performance going to be with the 8000 rated at 96/128?

I assume for $10 I am better off with 6000 3s and 5700 then 7700 and 8000 2s, is this correct?
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  #113  
Old 08-10-2006, 08:26 PM
TriPower TriPower is offline
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How do you determine when a truck is too big or heavy for the a Mamba Max? I have a new 5700 system, and an HPI MT2 truck with 12 cells that needs a motor. Is that truck too big for this system? Would I be better off with a bigger motor than the Mamba 5700?

http://www.hpiracing.com/kits/kitMain.php?partNo=10441
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  #114  
Old 08-10-2006, 08:52 PM
pimpride pimpride is offline
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It's a 1/10th scale truck, so the mamba will work fine. If it was a bigger truck then it would need the Mamba Monster Max. The MT2 isn't that big/heavy as compared to an 1/8 scale.
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  #115  
Old 08-10-2006, 08:52 PM
TriPower TriPower is offline
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One more question: I've been reading the Mamba user manual, and it shows two wiring schemes, one for reverse and one for high power. How much power do you sacrifice to have reverse?
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  #116  
Old 08-10-2006, 09:00 PM
TriPower TriPower is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pimpride
It's a 1/10th scale truck, so the mamba will work fine. If it was a bigger truck then it would need the Mamba Monster Max. The MT2 isn't that big/heavy as compared to an 1/8 scale.
Thanks. I'm having a hard time telling what a real 1/10 scale truck is. The MT2 is labeled as 1/10, and so is my Revo. Big difference in size! They seem like the same type of design to me, so why the big difference in ratio?
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  #117  
Old 08-10-2006, 09:54 PM
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glassdoctor glassdoctor is offline
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MT2 is typical 1/10 stadium truck size, and the Revo is a "1/10 monster truck". It really isn't a traditional 1/10 size... Traxxas just calls it that.

I consider the emaxx and revo to be 1/8 personally especially when guys modify them and slap the big tires on them. They weigh the same or more than a 1/8 buggy.

I think we should look at it by weight class. Most 1/10 stuff is under 4lbs. Emaxx, Tmaxx, and most 1/8 buggies are over 8lbs stock and the trucks are more of course.

So if it weighs like more than like 6lbs or so, it's not 1/10 IMHO.... but what the heck does that matter?
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  #118  
Old 08-11-2006, 08:31 AM
RCSavage RCSavage is offline
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I bought 2 Mamba 5700kv systems about a week ago. (7700 too fast for my offroad app) I find the 5700kv system perfect on 6 cell ib4200 matched packs for my 2 wheel drive buggy. However I find it needing alittle more power for 4wd. On the box it shows reference to a 6700kv motor and the website says a 6900kv in the faq "what system to use." However I do not see a system with that motor listed on the site for purchase. Will the 6700kv motor be avail seperately? and when?
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  #119  
Old 08-11-2006, 08:35 AM
RCSavage RCSavage is offline
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Forgot, another question. If looking at other brand motors some are listed in turns while some use Kv ratings. If I went to a Hacker c40 series they are offered in 7t 8t 9t 10t. Which one would relate to something in between 5700 and 7700kv.

Also will all 6700kv motors have the same power, or just RPM?

All this will not be needed if the 6700kv motor will be avail. shortly.
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  #120  
Old 08-11-2006, 03:17 PM
Key Key is offline
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Qstn2 - kv rating for brushless brushless motors designed for ESCs without sensors will always display kv ratings.

Here are the ratings for the c40 class sorted by wind/turn:

W kv
6 6942
7 5950
8 5250
9 4667
10 4200
11 3818
12 3500
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  #121  
Old 08-11-2006, 04:23 PM
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ElectricThunder ElectricThunder is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TriPower
How do you determine when a truck is too big or heavy for the a Mamba Max? I have a new 5700 system, and an HPI MT2 truck with 12 cells that needs a motor. Is that truck too big for this system? Would I be better off with a bigger motor than the Mamba 5700?

http://www.hpiracing.com/kits/kitMain.php?partNo=10441
The mamba would be fine in that truck. Another member here runs/ran a GTB 5.5 or 6.5 in his MT2 conversion, and it was handling it quite fine. The Mamba is way more powerful on 12 cells, so it should be no problems at all.
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  #122  
Old 08-11-2006, 05:35 PM
SpEEdyBL SpEEdyBL is offline
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Shawn, which motor (4600 or 5700) on 3s lipo would you say runs the coolest geared for 50 mph? I see on the charts that the 4600 is good for 45mph and the the 5700 for 60. I want something in between. Or how about this: Can you give me a range of speeds for which the 4600 runs cooler than the 5700 and vs versa? (On 3s lipo of course) I don't care about acceleration curves or runtimes so much. It would be nice if the 5700 on 3s lipo could be geared down for 40mph and not overheat, while having the option for rediculous speed runs.
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  #123  
Old 08-11-2006, 08:01 PM
DeadSouls DeadSouls is offline
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Well, I am now doing wheelies with my T4. I geared the 7700 with 21/87 and the car spent more time on its back than on its wheels. The setup is very, very fast. It's funny on the Castle Creations tuning guide they have the question "How do I tune this thing down?!?" and its so true. The setup has so much power that you have to gear it down.

I am very happy with my Mamba Max and 7700 motor. I have a new addition to my Christmas wishlist. The new Traxxas Stampede with either the Mamba Max or the Mamba Monster Max whichever is faster/funner/better suited to the car.
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  #124  
Old 08-11-2006, 08:03 PM
DeadSouls DeadSouls is offline
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I did have a quick questions about the Mamba Max ESC. What is considered a dangerous temperature? Or, what temperature range should we avoid? I have read the documentation and found that maximum motor temperature should not exceed 200F. What about the ESC? I have not found any documentation.

Btw, today I ran with a 21/87 gearing on pavement in 90F weather and the motor got up to 150F and the ESC 181F.
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  #125  
Old 08-11-2006, 09:42 PM
pimpride pimpride is offline
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The ESC shuts down if it gets too hot, so until it does that then don't worry about it.
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